You may or may not know that Disney and the guys in the art studio over there did thier part in the Big One back 70+ years ago. Walt had served in France during WWI as a infantryman amongst the mustard gas so when WWII came about, he offered his studios services. They made all sorts of insignia (over 3000) for the military and the USNI has a gallery of it over at their website
Enjoy!
Get it, “Mine…Sweeper”
HAaaa
Here at LSOZI, we are going to take out every Wednesday for a look at the old steam/diesel navies of the 1859-1946 time period and will profile a different ship each week.
– Christopher Eger
Warship Wednesday, July 31
Here we see the humble technical research ship USS Pueblo (AGER-2 ) chugging across the seas in 1967.
In the 1960s the US Navy commissioned several of what were termed ‘auxiliary environmental research ships’ (AGER). Offically these ships wandered the seas conducting research into atmospheric and communications phenomena for the sake of science. This of course was a cover for soaking up juicy bits if SIGINT and ELINT from Soviet, Chinese, North Korean, and other ships at sea and shore inland.
These ships had a special system named Technical Research Ship Special Communications, or TRSSCOM (pronounced tress-com). This Earth-Moon-Earth (EME) communications system used a special gyroscope-stabilized 16-foot parabolic antenna, in which Radio signals were transmitted toward the moon, where they would bounce back toward the Earth and be received by a large 64-foot parabolic antenna at a Naval Communications Station in Cheltenham, Maryland (near Washington, D.C.) or Wahiawa, Hawaii. Communications could occur only when the moon was visible simultaneously at the ship’s location and in Cheltenham or Wahiawa. The gyro stabilization of the antenna kept the antenna pointed at the moon while the ship rolled and pitched on the surface of the ocean.
Some 11 ships altogether were converted as spyships. Most were cargo ships, old Liberty and Victory, and C1-M-AV1 types which had high free board and lots of room for cargo which led to lots of space for spy gear (err…atmospheric instruments). Three of the 11 were small Army Freight Supply ships which were much lower to the surface of the ocean. The Army had used these boats (yes the Army has a fleet too) during WWII to resupply garrisons and bases strung all across Europe, Africa, and the Pacific. These ‘wackiest ships in the army’ were simple boats that could motor around little harbors and discharge drums of diesel, cases of C-rats, tents, toilet paper and ammo then head to the next port.
This is how the Pueblo looked when she served in the US Army during WWII
One of these three 177-foot Army ships transferred to the Navy for use as a spy (sorry, research) boat was Army Freight and Supply ship 344 (FS-344). Commissioned at New Orleans on 7 April 1945, she had a crew of USCGR officers who used the ship as a training boat for new sea-going Army sailors. Laid up she was brought back into service to shuttle cargo around during Korea. The Army, with a huge number of these boats in their possession, placed FS-344 in their version of mothballs in 1954. The Navy picked her up quietly in 1966, made a few simple improvements, added a lot of commo gear, and named her USS Pueblo.
commissioned into the USN on 13 May 1967, she carried a crew of navy and marine communications technicians on a mission in support of the National Security Agency. It should be remembered that the NSA didn’t officially exist as far as the public was concerned at the time and was commonly called ‘No Such Agency’ by those who did know. The ship was commissioned just three weeks before another intelligence gathering auxiliary, the USS Liberty (AGTR-5), was attacked in the Med on 8 June 1967 by the Israeli Defence Forces during the Six Day War. The Liberty was hit while in international waters off the northern coast of the Sinai Peninsula and her armament of four M2 machineguns was outclassed against modern attack aircraft and three torpedo boats– an ominous harbinger for what the smaller Pueblo had in her future.
On January 23, 1968, as the Pueblo sat 15.4-miles off the North Korean coastline, she was approached at some 4000-yards by an unidentified Project 201M (“SO-1”) class Soviet made subchaser. This 1950s designed 138-foot patrol boat wasn’t very capable against submarines, but she did have a Reya (“Pot Head”) surface search radar with a 25nm range, a 57mm popgun, and some 23mm anti-aircraft guns. Worse, the Pueblo could only make 12-knots downhill with a tailwind while the commie subchaser could bust out 27.
Then four torpedo boats showed up and that’s when the wheels fell off. These boats were Chinese made P4 boats, an improvement of the old Soviet G5-class motor torpedo boat made during WWII from a hybrid British-Italian design. Only 63-feet long they could make over 55-knots on a pair of 1200hp engines and packed a twin 14.5mm heavy machineguns mount forward and a pair of 450mm torpedoes each. The PT boats had almost three times the horsepower as the 25-year old freighter and showed it.
The Pueblo could not outrun the subchaser and the four torpedo boats in anyone’s imagination. If she stood and fought it out, she only four M2 machineguns mounted on deck. While the old Ma Duece is a 12.7mm (50 cal) heavy, Pueblo’s were in no condition to fight. To appear as inoffensive as possible, they were slimed with CLP and covered by tarps (it was January in Korea guys, which means they were frozen) and their ammo was stored below deck. Only one bluejacket had a working knowledge of these guns and their were no Gunners Mate ratings aboard. Sure the nearly 1000-ton converted freighter could have tried to ram her way out of trouble against the smaller craft, but it would be like a turtle fighting four rabbits– armed with torpedoes.
Nevertheless the Pueblo maneuvered wildly and dodged Korean attempts to board her for over two hours, catching shellfire and 12.7mm rounds during the chase in her hull and superstructure. Repeated calls for assistance from the US fleet got no help and soon a pair of MIGs were circling the boat. Taking fire and with the torpedo boats taking the covers off of their tubes, it was a no-win situation. With no other option, the ship turned and followed the subchaser into North Korean waters where the crew was captured (one of which, Fireman Duane Hodges, was killed by a Korean shell) and held for 11 months. The ship’s captain, LCDR. Lloyd M. Bucher was wounded and later received the purple heart.
Anybody recognize the one-finger salute?
After much political passion play, the crew was finally released and walked over the DMZ in single file, leaving the Pueblo in North Korean hands. They endured 335 days of harsh imprisonment.
Hodges earned the silver star posthumously as did the ships Operations Officer, LTJG Schumacher. Six men earned Bronze stars for their actions. All crewmembers earned the Navy Marine Corps Commendation Medal and the POW medal. One marine won the Navy Cross for his heroism during the internment as follows, “The President of the United States of America takes pleasure in presenting the Navy Cross to Sergeant Robert J. Hammond, United States Marine Corps, for extraordinary heroism as a crew member of the U.S.S. PUEBLO (AGER-2) during their period of captivity in North Korea from 24 January to 23 December 1968.
Following his capture, Sergeant Hammond, through his unyielding resistance and fierce loyalty to his shipmates and his country, became a symbol of resistance, courage, and dedication to the United States. This infuriated the North Koreans, who singled him out for more frequent and far more severe brutalities than were administered to the other prisoners. When the North Koreans learned that the U.S.S. PUEBLO crew had duped them in their international propaganda efforts, they intensified their efforts to break the will and spirit of the crew through the administration of indiscriminate beatings. Realizing that many of his shipmates were in danger of being permanently injured or killed, Sergeant Hammond willingly attempted to sacrifice his own life in order that his shipmates might be spared further torture. The following day the North Koreans ceased their beatings and tortures. Sergeant Hammond’s devotion to duty and heroic actions against seemingly impossible odds reflected great credit upon himself and upheld the highest traditions of the Marine Corps and the United States Naval Service.”
The writing was on the wall for the AGER/AGTR project and by 1970 the entire fleet had been taken offline.
The Pueblo herself has been kept in decent condition by her current possessors (the US Navy still ‘owns’ her and as such is still carried on the US Navy List as ‘In commission’). Her keel laid in 1944 she is the oldest commissioned warship in the US fleet at age 77 with only Old Ironsides having more history on her hull. From time to time the ship gets a new coat of paint and has been towed from one harbor to another, posing a very curious tourist attraction wherever it goes in the freedom loving Peoples Republic.
The Pueblo Veterans Assoc is keeping the lights on for her in the States . Perhaps she will return to the US one day.
Stranger things have happened.
Specs
Displacement: 550 tons light, 895 tons full, 345 tons dead
Length: 177 ft (53.9 m)
Beam: 32 ft (9.7 m)
Draft: 9 ft (2.7 m)
Propulsion: twin 500hp GM Cleveland Division 6-278A 6-cyl V6 diesel engines
Speed: 12.7 knots (23.5 km/h)
Complement: 42 mariners as a cargo ship (had a 82 man crew in 1968 as a AGER)
Armament: None as freighter, 4 × Browning .50-caliber machine guns as AGER
If you liked this column, please consider joining the International Naval Research Organization (INRO)
They are possibly one of the best sources of naval lore http://www.warship.org/naval.htm
The International Naval Research Organization is a non-profit corporation dedicated to the encouragement of the study of naval vessels and their histories, principally in the era of iron and steel warships (about 1860 to date). Its purpose is to provide information and a means of contact for those interested in warships.
Nearing their 50th Anniversary, Warship International, the written tome of the INRO has published hundreds of articles, most of which are unique in their sweep and subject.
I’m a member, so should you be!
So you are a frogman and, while you are froggin it up, you come snorkel-to-snorkel with another wetsuit-clad combat swimmer. You reach for your dive knife but come up short because you realize that you just brought a knife to a gunfight. Well, that dastardly commie has a SPP-1 pistol, and it works underwater.
Underwater divers have been used by militaries around the world for centuries. As far back as the 1843, the British Royal Navy and others used divers for salvage. However, these early divers were tethered to the surface by lines that fed oxygen. The first ‘frogmen’ who swam independent of support ships had to do so with just a set of fins, a facemask, and a knife. These early combat swimmers reconned beaches in World War 2 as well as planted explosives when the opportunity arose.
It wasn’t until self-contained breathing apparatus including open and closed circuit varieties came about in the late 1940s that military divers could stay below the surface for longer periods. This new technology led to a greater flexibility of operations that included the laying of limpet mines on enemy ships in harbor. Soon most modern navies had specialized teams of frogmen optimized for underwater recon, sabotage, and other dirty deeds done dirt-cheap.
Read the rest in my column at GUNS.com
If you drive a mini-sub to work, learned Russian as your first language and have a closet full of wetsuits, odds are you may have a working knowledge of the Avtomat Podvodnyj Spetsialnyj better known in the west as the APS. It’s the world’s only known underwater assault rifle and its James Bond-style interesting.
First off, it’s important to remember that this weapon wasn’t a prototype that looked revolutionary on paper only to never get used; it was designed in the 1970s, placed into production at the TsNIITochMash plant and issued for use to untold thousands of Russian military types. The Soviets in the 1970s were anxious to build the world’s largest navy and were running a very close second to the US fleet. With more than 300 submarines and up to 50 at sea at any time, the Soviet Red Banner Fleet, led by the iconic Admiral Sergey Gorshkov, felt the secret to a communist victory on the waves was in operating under them.
Of course, you couldn’t have the largest submarine fleet in the world without a huge legion of underwater commandos—who needed guns.
Read the rest in my column at GUNS.com
The following list was released today, including the vessels set to decom next year. Looks like the last of the Oliver Hazard Perry class frigates are toast. Two ships are going to mothballs, one (Observation Island) to the scrappers, one submarine to be recycled, a minesweeper laid up for parts, and the rest possibly given to foreign governments.
“The projected FY14 ship inactivation schedule for inactivating U.S. naval ships is promulgated as follows to facilitate fleet planning efforts to conduct an inactivation availability:
Ship Name Inactivation Post Decom Status
USS FORD (FFG 54) 31 Oct 2013 See Note 1
USS THACH (FFG 43) 15 Nov 2013 See Note 1
USS NICHOLAS (FFG 47) 17 Mar 2014 See Note 1
USS DE WERT (FFG 45) 04 Apr 2014 See Note 1
USS RENTZ (FFG 46) 23 May 2014 See Note 1
USS HALYBURTON (FFG 40) 08 Sep 2014 See Note 1
USS ROBERT G BRADLEY (FFG 49) 28 Mar 2014 See Note 1
USNS OBSERVATION ISLAND (T-AGM 23)01 Apr 2014 See Note 2
USS AVENGER (MCM 1) 30 Aug 2014 See Note 3
USS DALLAS (SSN 700) 26 Sep 2014 See Note 4
USNS BRIDGE (T-AOE 10) 30 Sep 2014 See Note 5
USS DENVER (LPD 9) 30 Sep 2014 See Note 5
Note 1: Designated for foreign military sale (cold). It is Navy policy that ships designated for FMS transfer shall not be stripped. Stripping of ships provides diminished operational capability to maritime partners and corrodes our efforts to build maritime partner capacity. TYCOMS are required to ensure strict adherence to this direction. NAVSEA PMS 326 will issue additional guidance via SEPCOR to Fleet TYCOMS identifying non-transferrable technology. Except in the case of C3/C4 emergent CASREPS, no removals of installed equipment (e.g., Combat, C4I, HME SYSTEMS, etc.) will be permitted except as specifically authorized by OPNAV N9I in response to a record request submitted by PEO IWS or respective NAVSEA ship program office no later than 90 days prior to the ships official retirement date that includes: a comprehensive list (by ship) of specific installed equipment desired for removal; justification for the removal that includes evidence that the Navy supply system, TYCOM/RMC is unable to fulfill the requirement; an assessment of the requestor’s ability to restore the equipment in operational condition in the event the vessel transfers as a cold FMS ship; and coordination via the respective Systems Command. All other equipment/supply removals are to be conducted per ref (a).
Note 2: Dismantlement (scrap). MSC shall submit a naval message per ref (b) NLT 90 days prior to the ships’ inactivation to CNO WASHINGTON DC //00/09/N4/N42/N9/N9I//, COPY COMNAVSEASYSCOM WASHINGTON DC//SEA 05/21/, INACTSHIPOFF PORTSMOUTH VA//00/01// and supporting activities advising of the planned retirement, disposition, and funding ISO the ships’ inactivation. MSC shall coordinate directly with NAVSEA 21I regarding lay-up requirements and custody transfer to either NAVSEA or MARAD. MSC shall adhere to refs (b) and (c) status reporting requirements.
Note 3: Utilize as a logistic support asset primarily ISO remaining ships in its class.
Note 4: Date inactivation begins in a naval shipyard and the unit is no longer available for operational tasking. Official status of the vessel will be in-commission/in-reserve (ICIR) pending final decommissioning. Final decom date shall be reported to the CNO and NVR Custodian per refs (b) and (c).
Note 5: Retain in a retention status under NAVSEA custody ISO future mobilization requirements. 3. Per refs (b) and (d), COMPACFLT and COMUSFLTFORCOM shall coordinate with their respective Type Commanders and submit an organizational change request (OCR) with enough lead time for OPNAV to staff and approve the final decommissioning/inactivation of a naval vessel. 4. Per ref (b), all ship Commanding Officers/Masters or Ship Immediate Superior in Command (ISIC) shall send a separate naval message announcing that the actual retirement date has occurred. It shall be addressed to CNO WASHINGTON DC//00/09/N1/N2/N6/N4/N3/N5/ support activities, COMNAVSEASYSCOM WASHINGTON DC//SEA 05C/SEA 21// and NAVHISTHERITAGECOM N8/N9/N9I//. Info addees shall include the chain of command, all appropriate WASHINGTON DC. Message should give a brief history of the life of the ship to include significant events. 5. Adjustments to a ship’s official inactivation date that crosses the current fiscal year must be coordinated with OPNAV N9I per ref (b) due to the reporting requirement that Navy must inform Congress on execution year force structure changes that differ from what Congress authorized/appropriated and signed into law by the President. OPNAV shall promulgate changes to the inactivation year as required.
Here at LSOZI, we are going to take out every Wednesday for a look at the old steam/diesel navies of the 1859-1946 time period and will profile a different ship each week.
– Christopher Eger
Warship Wednesday, July 10.
Here we see USC&GSS Pathfinder, a classic ship from another age. Built on the lines of a clipper she lived through three naval wars and served the United States Coast and Geodetic Survey for forty years, mapping most of the Philippines and ending her life as a wreck in her waters. She was built 1897-98 by the Crescent Shipyard at Morris Heights, New Jersey. Her architect was Lewis Nixon, a household name among fast yacht builders at the turn of the century. She was a three deck steel ship of extra strength built for work in the Aleutian Archipelago where strong currents, distances from supply bases required a vessel of considerable power and coal capacity.
She had 15 water tight compartments with dimensions of 196′ 3″ over all, 33′ 6″ beam, 19′ 8″ “depth of hold” and equipped for sea draws 13′. She is brigantine-rigged with some 4,500 square feet of canvas and a single, 10′ diameter 13′ pitch, screw. Her vertical triple expansion steam engines with twenty-eight inch stroke developed 846 horsepower or 1,173 horsepower under forced draft with a speed of 10.5 to 13 knots. Her range was estimated at about 5,000 miles with a bunker capacity of 240 tons of coal. She was entirely steel with three decks.
Although built for the USC&GS, the Spanish-American War intervened in her birth. In June 1898 the Navy took near-possesion of her and sailed her with a crew of 65 bluejackets lead by USC&GS officers (what today would be NOAA Ocean Service officers) and sailed her to Hampton Roads. There it was envisioned she could be converted to an armed auxiliary cruiser. Before this was done, the war ended and she continued to the Pacific as the USC&GSS Pathfinder and not the USS Pathfinder in 1899. She spent a year doing coastal survey work along the California, Alaskan and Hawaiian coasts before being sent to the new US possession of the Philippines.
Survey work involved several ship’s launches moving in a line along with ashore teams equipped with surveyors tools for making precise measurements. Without the work put in by this ship on a 40-year mission, the retaking of the Philippines by the US Navy in WWII would have been much harder. Some of the charts made from surveys done by Pathfinder (above) are still in use today.
With no reliable charts of the huge archipelago, the Pathfinder, meant for use in Alaska, spent four decades in the PI, combing every inch of shoreline. By 1910 she had a ‘submarine sentry’– a device which warned the crew when she was shoaling by a series of kites, as well as a refrigeration system and wireless; making her one of the most modern ships afloat.As her original crew retired, they were at first augmented then replaced by local Filipinos. By 1920 the entire ship, save for a handful of USC&GS officers, were natives.
The PATHFINDER in drydock at Kowloon, 1906. NOAA Photo
Over the years she was sometimes pressed into transporting Philippine Constabulary troops and US soldiers to fight against the lengthy insurgency along the islands.
The crew at least twice had a run in with pirates, was beached in wild typhoons, dodged the German raider Emden in WWI, and watched nervously as Japanese planes flew dangerously close to her in the 1930s. When World War Two erupted in the Pacific, the 42-year-old converted yacht chopped over to the Navy’s control and she found herself the target of Japanese bombs at Corregidor. Damaged beyond wartime repair, she was beached in a sinking condition and burned so that the Japanese could not salvage her.
Within a year, the USS Pathfinder AGS-1, the first US Navy oceanographic survey ship, replaced her and assumed her proud name. She served until 1972.
Currently the US Navy still maintains a survey ship named Pathfinder, the USNS Pathfinder (TAGS-60), a 4,762-ton ship that has been in commission since 1994.
Specs
Length: 196.25 ft (59.82 m)
Beam: 33.5 ft (10.2 m)
Draft: 13 ft (4.0 m)
Depth of hold: 19.66 ft (5.99 m)
Decks: Three
Installed power: Triple expansion steam engines developing 846 horsepower or 1,173 horsepower under forced draft
Sail plan: Brigantine-rigged, 4,500 square feet of canvas
Speed: 10.5 to 13 knots
Range: 5,000 miles
Notes: Specifically built for Alaska service
If you liked this column, please consider joining the International Naval Research Organization
(INRO)
They are possibly one of the best sources of naval lore http://www.warship.org/naval.htm
The International Naval Research Organization is a non-profit corporation dedicated to the encouragement of the study of naval vessels and their histories, principally in the era of iron and steel warships (about 1860 to date). Its purpose is to provide information and a means of contact for those interested in warships.
Nearing their 50th Anniversary, Warship International, the written tome of the INRO has published hundreds of articles, most of which are unique in their sweep and subject.
I’m a member, so should you be!
Teddy Roosevelt, considered by many to be the father of the huge US fleets of the 20th century, once said, ‘Speak softly, but carry a big stick’. Well, the 16-inch/50 caliber Mark 7 cannons of the US Navy’s Iowa class battleships were the biggest stick the country had for over 50 years.
In 1938, the world was steaming out of control towards war. Nazi Germany was building a class of huge battleships that carried 15-inch guns. Britain, France, and Italy were responding with huge new warships of their own with similar guns. Imperial Japan, not to be outdone by any navy, was building battleships with 18-inch guns. The US Navy had a few classes of warships that had 16-inch/45 caliber guns, which were no nerf pistols by any means, but with the naval arms race and the war drums beating, they wanted something bigger and better. This led to the 16-inch/50 caliber Mark 7.
And the navy is about to send a bunch of them to the scrapyard….unless you want one..
Read the rest in my column at Guns.com
USS IOWA firing broadside of 16 inchers note the pressure wave from the muzzle blast
Pretty interesting video of the Brimstone AshM system, firing three short range (105-pound/Hellfire sized, 12km range) missiles and taking out three simulated fast attack craft. Of course, it looked like the ‘FACs’ were not maneuvering and were kinda on the slow side, but still…
“MBDA’s combat proven, UK developed, Brimstone missile carried out the world’s first surface to surface salvo engagement of multiple Fast In-shore Attack Craft (FIAC) threats with a single button push. The success of the trial has shown Brimstone’s unrivaled ability to swiftly strike numerous individual vessels without the need to laboriously designate each target, thereby demonstrating its prowess as a fire and forget maritime surface attack weapon. “
During the Dansk-Hanseatic war (who doesn’t remember that like yesterday?), Christoffer, son of the Dansk king Waldemar IV Atterdag was killed in action by a cannonball on 11th of June 1363 during a sea-fight. This is one of the first instances of warships using cannon at sea.
The picture below is of a ship much more advanced than the galleys of the 14th century. Its the 238-foot long, 640-ton HSwMS Helsingborg of his majesty’s Swedish Navy. She is the second in the new class of Swedish Visby-class corvettes. These ‘stealth ships’ are constructed with a sandwich design consisting of a PVC core with a carbon fiber and vinyl laminate with good conductivity. Good conductivity and surface flatness means a low radar signature, while good heat insulation lowers the infrared signature and increases survivability in case of fire. The composite sandwich used is also non-magnetic, which lowers the magnetic signature. Composites are also very strong for their relative weight, and less weight means a higher top speed and better maneuverability. The composite weighs roughly 50% less than the equivalent strength steel.
The Helsingborg‘s angular design reduces its radar signature (or radar cross-section). Jan Nilsson, one of the designers, told BBC News Online: “We are able to reduce the radar cross-section by 99%. That doesn’t mean it’s 99% invisible, it means that we have reduced its detection range.” Even the 57 mm cannon barrel can be folded into the turret to reduce its cross-section.
Speaking of 57mm guns, that’s her Bofors Mk3 ripping off at 220-rounds per minute. In US service the Mk 3 is known as the Mark 110 Mod 0 and is in use on the new Legend-class National Security Cutters of the USCG as well as the two classes of Littoral Combat Ships (with some issues). The mounting has 120 ready rounds, and a total of 1,000 rounds in mounting, each a 6.1 kg (13 lb) shell with a range of 17,000m.
Besides the 57mm hood ornament, she carries 8 × RBS15 Mk2 antiship missiles, 4 × 400 mm torpedo launchers for Type 45 torpedoes, Mines, depth charges, and has provision for a dozen 127 mm ALECTO anti-submarine rocket launchers and 8 × Umkhonto SAMs.
So, there you have it, a stealth ship powered by state of the art gas turbines and diesel engines, still packing naval cannon some 600-years later.
Take that Christoffer.
Today when two or more warplanes mix it up over the skies in combat, they usually do it with air-to-air missiles. Nevertheless, back in World War Two, when one aircraft met another in combat over the battlefield, the duel was carried out with guns.
Just nine years after the Wright Brothers proved that a heavier than air vehicle could even fly, the US Army put on gun on one in an experiment. Captain Charles de Forest Chandler, shown above seated in the passenger seat of a Wright Model B Flyer, fired the Lewis light machinegun from the airplane in flight on June 7 and 8, 1912. This is thought to be the first time, other than random rifles and pistols carried by pilots, that a gun was fired from an aircraft in flight. This was just in time because just two years later, World War 1 brought about a completely new era of flying terror.
When the Fokker Eindecker, one of the first purpose-built fighter planes, took to the sky in 1915 armed with a single DWM Spandau MG14 Parabellum machine gun, synchronized to fire through the plane’s propeller, appeared, it was terrifying to the British and French pilots. This started a steady arms race that continued until the end of the war where most fighter, bomber, and scout aircraft were armed with as many as three .30 caliber machine guns whereas huge German Zeppelin dirigibles carried up to five.
By 1944, this would be considered well underarmed….
Read the rest in my column at Firearms Talk
